<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Ratings Agencies Reveal Real Risk of Banks</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.moneymorning.com.au/20091215/ratings-agencies-reveal-real-risk-of-banks.html/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.moneymorning.com.au/20091215/ratings-agencies-reveal-real-risk-of-banks.html</link>
	<description>Australian Financial News That Matters in 90 Seconds or Less</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 10 Sep 2010 14:01:06 +0100</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<xhtml:meta xmlns:xhtml="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" name="robots" content="noindex" />
	<item>
		<title>By: gypsy2454</title>
		<link>http://www.moneymorning.com.au/20091215/ratings-agencies-reveal-real-risk-of-banks.html/comment-page-1#comment-4041</link>
		<dc:creator>gypsy2454</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Dec 2009 10:49:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moneymorning.com.au/?p=2628#comment-4041</guid>
		<description>I would think that a mortgage backed security would only be worth the rating of the riskiest parts or it&#039;s pool, because that&#039;s the ones which will go default first.  how would investors differentiate between a good investment and some toxic ones if they package AAA, AA and some toxic waste all ab in one security. that will make them all look toxic to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would think that a mortgage backed security would only be worth the rating of the riskiest parts or it&#8217;s pool, because that&#8217;s the ones which will go default first.  how would investors differentiate between a good investment and some toxic ones if they package AAA, AA and some toxic waste all ab in one security. that will make them all look toxic to me.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: cb</title>
		<link>http://www.moneymorning.com.au/20091215/ratings-agencies-reveal-real-risk-of-banks.html/comment-page-1#comment-4039</link>
		<dc:creator>cb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Dec 2009 08:31:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moneymorning.com.au/?p=2628#comment-4039</guid>
		<description>Yes, that is a compelling argument that house prices would have been more contained if properly reflected in the CPI, and with higher rates I suspect that a lot of other prices as well, besides. But part of the scam is always to hide and disguise what is happening, and this is the primary reason why adjustments to the way the CPI is measured are being made. Consequently, similar to housing, ANYTHING that is being measured and looks like its price action will likely threaten the scam, will similarly be removed, or in some way modified, to hide the rapid rise in overall costs and prices. 

But to answer your point about my seeming inconsistency, PuntPal, I guess my view is that, whatever system the RBA is supporting or pursuing, they should damn well keep to it, instead of chopping and changing and wrongfooting people&#039;s expectations and calculations with business and money. So, if it is a fiat money system based on continuous credit and monetary expansion, then they must stick to it, or they will bring the whole house down. In some ways, the more fundamental consideration is consistency and certainty. Without these even sound money would be useless. The arguments behind sound money carry weight primarily because such would bring greater monetary and economic stability. 

So, the reason I am saying that it is the RBA that is going to cook our goose is because I see them now flooring the accellerator, and now hitting the breaks hard at a risk of stalling the engine altogether, and as with driving a car, such is unlikely to end well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, that is a compelling argument that house prices would have been more contained if properly reflected in the CPI, and with higher rates I suspect that a lot of other prices as well, besides. But part of the scam is always to hide and disguise what is happening, and this is the primary reason why adjustments to the way the CPI is measured are being made. Consequently, similar to housing, ANYTHING that is being measured and looks like its price action will likely threaten the scam, will similarly be removed, or in some way modified, to hide the rapid rise in overall costs and prices. </p>
<p>But to answer your point about my seeming inconsistency, PuntPal, I guess my view is that, whatever system the RBA is supporting or pursuing, they should damn well keep to it, instead of chopping and changing and wrongfooting people&#8217;s expectations and calculations with business and money. So, if it is a fiat money system based on continuous credit and monetary expansion, then they must stick to it, or they will bring the whole house down. In some ways, the more fundamental consideration is consistency and certainty. Without these even sound money would be useless. The arguments behind sound money carry weight primarily because such would bring greater monetary and economic stability. </p>
<p>So, the reason I am saying that it is the RBA that is going to cook our goose is because I see them now flooring the accellerator, and now hitting the breaks hard at a risk of stalling the engine altogether, and as with driving a car, such is unlikely to end well.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Marc</title>
		<link>http://www.moneymorning.com.au/20091215/ratings-agencies-reveal-real-risk-of-banks.html/comment-page-1#comment-4017</link>
		<dc:creator>Marc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Dec 2009 03:40:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moneymorning.com.au/?p=2628#comment-4017</guid>
		<description>In the Australian today
WESTPAC has priced $2 billion of mortgage backed securities - twice the size originally planned - in a sign confidence is returning. 

Does this mean that Westpac wants to palm off risky assets to gullible investors?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the Australian today<br />
WESTPAC has priced $2 billion of mortgage backed securities &#8211; twice the size originally planned &#8211; in a sign confidence is returning. </p>
<p>Does this mean that Westpac wants to palm off risky assets to gullible investors?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: BB</title>
		<link>http://www.moneymorning.com.au/20091215/ratings-agencies-reveal-real-risk-of-banks.html/comment-page-1#comment-4013</link>
		<dc:creator>BB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Dec 2009 00:45:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moneymorning.com.au/?p=2628#comment-4013</guid>
		<description>PuntPal - you sir a genius and have successfully opened the Pandora&#039;s box on the issue of CPI figures and the cost to service the purchase of a roof over our heads. There is no reasonable explanation as to why this important and significant consumer price was thrown out of the ABS &#039;basket of goods&#039; used to arrive at CPI but you can bloody bet that if it weren&#039;t given the flick in 1998 then house prices could never have skyrocketed to the extent they have because of your spot on assertion that the RBA would have invariably lifted official interest rates to fight the massive hidden inflation effects of housing and hence put the brakes on excessive mortgage borrowing.  Here&#039;s my two cents worth for the conspiracy theorists out there and the GST lies at the heart of it. Keating (when treasurer) wanted a GST. His party slapped him down. Hewson tried it and got nailed. Howard slyly got it up. We were always going to get it as a celebrated example of a broad based consumption tax is what every politico/economist will go hard over. What is the basic requirement to make certain government coffers swell from this tax? Of course! CONSUMPTION by CONSUMERS on a scale of which we never imagined. Government wants us to spend big and spend often. Business likes it too. They don&#039;t give a shit if its spending from your savings ( which is generally done with significant prior consideration of the purchase)  or swiping the magic plastic credit god which requires almost no thought whatsoever. The machine works best when everyone &#039;FEELS&#039; rich by buying things and stuff and more things and more stuff. Big homes, big SUV&#039;s, big lifestyles - buy it now, pay it off - whenever! Leaving mortgage costs within the band of CPI items would have had a limiting influence on the great indulgence of the shopper in us all without which the GST cannot deliver rivers of gold as it did to Costello and Howard - to be subsequently pissed up against a wall by Rudd and Swan. Merry Xmas to all the fellow contributors at MM - just off to do that last minute shopping at Hervey Westfield&#039;s never ever,  no deposit buy now pay in 2018 3 day never to be repeated Christmas sales promotion. They say if you don&#039;t spend a few thousand at Christmas on imported manufactured junk that no one really wants or uses then you just aren&#039;t getting into the spirit of this special time of year. I&#039;ve got my eye on a great $2,000 cappuccino maker that the brochure says is a must have in the kitchen even though I don&#039;t like coffee.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>PuntPal &#8211; you sir a genius and have successfully opened the Pandora&#8217;s box on the issue of CPI figures and the cost to service the purchase of a roof over our heads. There is no reasonable explanation as to why this important and significant consumer price was thrown out of the ABS &#8216;basket of goods&#8217; used to arrive at CPI but you can bloody bet that if it weren&#8217;t given the flick in 1998 then house prices could never have skyrocketed to the extent they have because of your spot on assertion that the RBA would have invariably lifted official interest rates to fight the massive hidden inflation effects of housing and hence put the brakes on excessive mortgage borrowing.  Here&#8217;s my two cents worth for the conspiracy theorists out there and the GST lies at the heart of it. Keating (when treasurer) wanted a GST. His party slapped him down. Hewson tried it and got nailed. Howard slyly got it up. We were always going to get it as a celebrated example of a broad based consumption tax is what every politico/economist will go hard over. What is the basic requirement to make certain government coffers swell from this tax? Of course! CONSUMPTION by CONSUMERS on a scale of which we never imagined. Government wants us to spend big and spend often. Business likes it too. They don&#8217;t give a shit if its spending from your savings ( which is generally done with significant prior consideration of the purchase)  or swiping the magic plastic credit god which requires almost no thought whatsoever. The machine works best when everyone &#8216;FEELS&#8217; rich by buying things and stuff and more things and more stuff. Big homes, big SUV&#8217;s, big lifestyles &#8211; buy it now, pay it off &#8211; whenever! Leaving mortgage costs within the band of CPI items would have had a limiting influence on the great indulgence of the shopper in us all without which the GST cannot deliver rivers of gold as it did to Costello and Howard &#8211; to be subsequently pissed up against a wall by Rudd and Swan. Merry Xmas to all the fellow contributors at MM &#8211; just off to do that last minute shopping at Hervey Westfield&#8217;s never ever,  no deposit buy now pay in 2018 3 day never to be repeated Christmas sales promotion. They say if you don&#8217;t spend a few thousand at Christmas on imported manufactured junk that no one really wants or uses then you just aren&#8217;t getting into the spirit of this special time of year. I&#8217;ve got my eye on a great $2,000 cappuccino maker that the brochure says is a must have in the kitchen even though I don&#8217;t like coffee.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: PuntPal</title>
		<link>http://www.moneymorning.com.au/20091215/ratings-agencies-reveal-real-risk-of-banks.html/comment-page-1#comment-4010</link>
		<dc:creator>PuntPal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 23:03:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moneymorning.com.au/?p=2628#comment-4010</guid>
		<description>Thanks cb - that was clearly explained and although I understand what inflation is, I wanted to understand exactly HOW the government manipulate the CPI. See it just sounds like we are crackpot conspirators when we make general allegations that the Government is effectively crooked.

But when it comes to house price inflation being specifically excluded in 1998 (about the time the boom was really taking off) then you have evidence and a smoking gun for the CPI conspiracy theory. As I have said too, this aspect of the CPI conspiracy is the most important due to the cost of living increase the housing ‘boom’ (I hate that word and its positive connotations!) has had on Gen Y and on future Generations.

So although the RBA doesn’t have the ability to include house price inflation under its mandate to manage inflation, it can probably interpret its mandate with enough flexibility to say that this house price bubble needs to be deflated in terms of managing the nation’s financial stability. I know you think Glenn Stevens is to blame for raising rates from emergency low levels – but I find that argument totally at odds with your concerns about excess liquidity causing inflation. Interest rates stop money from entering the economy because people are less eager to borrow from the Bankstas…</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks cb &#8211; that was clearly explained and although I understand what inflation is, I wanted to understand exactly HOW the government manipulate the CPI. See it just sounds like we are crackpot conspirators when we make general allegations that the Government is effectively crooked.</p>
<p>But when it comes to house price inflation being specifically excluded in 1998 (about the time the boom was really taking off) then you have evidence and a smoking gun for the CPI conspiracy theory. As I have said too, this aspect of the CPI conspiracy is the most important due to the cost of living increase the housing ‘boom’ (I hate that word and its positive connotations!) has had on Gen Y and on future Generations.</p>
<p>So although the RBA doesn’t have the ability to include house price inflation under its mandate to manage inflation, it can probably interpret its mandate with enough flexibility to say that this house price bubble needs to be deflated in terms of managing the nation’s financial stability. I know you think Glenn Stevens is to blame for raising rates from emergency low levels – but I find that argument totally at odds with your concerns about excess liquidity causing inflation. Interest rates stop money from entering the economy because people are less eager to borrow from the Bankstas…</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: PuntPal</title>
		<link>http://www.moneymorning.com.au/20091215/ratings-agencies-reveal-real-risk-of-banks.html/comment-page-1#comment-3998</link>
		<dc:creator>PuntPal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 03:53:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moneymorning.com.au/?p=2628#comment-3998</guid>
		<description>JC - Sorry, I didnt mean to imply you were whinging and you&#039;re right, for me it is an emotional topic. Not because I am 27 and want to buy a house one day, but because I think it will eventually financially ruin the nation...

To me, this is the missing link - its so simple, house price inflation has been excluded from the CPI and therefore monetary policy has totally and utterly failed to address one of the most damaging forms of inflation.

Presuming there is an accurate way of measuring the cost of buying a house, then surely this should be inserted into the CPI or even a supplementary component of the CPI (i.e. CPI + cost of housing).

I am surprised Steve Keen, Kris Sayce, Denning and others havent honed in on this point, thats all - I just find it amazing</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JC &#8211; Sorry, I didnt mean to imply you were whinging and you&#8217;re right, for me it is an emotional topic. Not because I am 27 and want to buy a house one day, but because I think it will eventually financially ruin the nation&#8230;</p>
<p>To me, this is the missing link &#8211; its so simple, house price inflation has been excluded from the CPI and therefore monetary policy has totally and utterly failed to address one of the most damaging forms of inflation.</p>
<p>Presuming there is an accurate way of measuring the cost of buying a house, then surely this should be inserted into the CPI or even a supplementary component of the CPI (i.e. CPI + cost of housing).</p>
<p>I am surprised Steve Keen, Kris Sayce, Denning and others havent honed in on this point, thats all &#8211; I just find it amazing</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: JC</title>
		<link>http://www.moneymorning.com.au/20091215/ratings-agencies-reveal-real-risk-of-banks.html/comment-page-1#comment-3996</link>
		<dc:creator>JC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 02:19:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moneymorning.com.au/?p=2628#comment-3996</guid>
		<description>PP, you&#039;re similar to me is that you&#039;re a keen learner and want to see through the obfuscation. We also both openly admit that we are simple-minded.  I have noticed that you focus on property and it&#039;s an emotive topic. I&#039;m now viewing Australia from afar (Japan) and the cost of accommodation or the desire to take on a mortgage doesn&#039;t affect me. It&#039;s sometimes easier for me to put things in perspective; however as a salaried professional, I estimated that I would need to find a position in Australia comfortably north of at least 150K to give me a comparable lifestyle to what I enjoy now.  The cost of living in Australia, of which shelter is a core component, doesn&#039;t add up for me at this stage of my life.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>PP, you&#8217;re similar to me is that you&#8217;re a keen learner and want to see through the obfuscation. We also both openly admit that we are simple-minded.  I have noticed that you focus on property and it&#8217;s an emotive topic. I&#8217;m now viewing Australia from afar (Japan) and the cost of accommodation or the desire to take on a mortgage doesn&#8217;t affect me. It&#8217;s sometimes easier for me to put things in perspective; however as a salaried professional, I estimated that I would need to find a position in Australia comfortably north of at least 150K to give me a comparable lifestyle to what I enjoy now.  The cost of living in Australia, of which shelter is a core component, doesn&#8217;t add up for me at this stage of my life.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: PuntPal</title>
		<link>http://www.moneymorning.com.au/20091215/ratings-agencies-reveal-real-risk-of-banks.html/comment-page-1#comment-3992</link>
		<dc:creator>PuntPal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 01:24:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moneymorning.com.au/?p=2628#comment-3992</guid>
		<description>p.s. JC - I also think that those who are concerned about the housing bubble should haev focussed their attention on this. Rather than whinge about preferential tax treatment and media spruiking etc... the real way the bubble was allowed to form was because in 98 they removed mortgage finance from the CPI and that allowed people to think inflation was under check, when in reality the cost of living (paying off a mortgage) was going through the roof</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>p.s. JC &#8211; I also think that those who are concerned about the housing bubble should haev focussed their attention on this. Rather than whinge about preferential tax treatment and media spruiking etc&#8230; the real way the bubble was allowed to form was because in 98 they removed mortgage finance from the CPI and that allowed people to think inflation was under check, when in reality the cost of living (paying off a mortgage) was going through the roof</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: PuntPal</title>
		<link>http://www.moneymorning.com.au/20091215/ratings-agencies-reveal-real-risk-of-banks.html/comment-page-1#comment-3991</link>
		<dc:creator>PuntPal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 01:22:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moneymorning.com.au/?p=2628#comment-3991</guid>
		<description>I am going to go through your message later cb, flat out at the moment.

JC - I can only ask and he is more than entitled to ignore the suggestions. And rather that vaguely say that the CPI is a con, I was just suggesting he focus on the exclusion of house price inflation. Kris seems to be pretty keen on showing why the property market is rigged, however since I have been on MM I have never heard him bring up this specific point. It was just a suggestions and I think I was entitled to put it forward</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am going to go through your message later cb, flat out at the moment.</p>
<p>JC &#8211; I can only ask and he is more than entitled to ignore the suggestions. And rather that vaguely say that the CPI is a con, I was just suggesting he focus on the exclusion of house price inflation. Kris seems to be pretty keen on showing why the property market is rigged, however since I have been on MM I have never heard him bring up this specific point. It was just a suggestions and I think I was entitled to put it forward</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: cb</title>
		<link>http://www.moneymorning.com.au/20091215/ratings-agencies-reveal-real-risk-of-banks.html/comment-page-1#comment-3990</link>
		<dc:creator>cb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 00:43:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moneymorning.com.au/?p=2628#comment-3990</guid>
		<description>Sorry, PuntPal, I missed addressing  that question of yours before. The answer is this: 
1. CPI is always manipulated downwards, to disguise the real rate of extra money being created, borrowed, and lent out by bankstas, which eventually ends up one way or another as moneyflow into the real economy IN EXCESS OF GOODS AND SERVICES CREATED. 

2. Any excess money and credit created like this, will end up pushing up nominal prices in some sector or other, simply because excess cash/liquidity is chasing the given and available goods and services at any one time. In other words, this is inflation. Money and credit hitting the economy in excess of goods and services created and available to purchase with that money within a the given period of time. 

3. This is how you get rising prices, which nowadays is called inflation, instead of inflation being defined as it should be, as that which causes rising prices, and namely the said excess liquidity being pumped into the economy. 

4. So, if inflation is defined as rising prices, then anyone claiming to fight inflation, will have to show that prices are not rising. This is one of the dirty jobs given to the ABS, so that the populace can be lied to about just how fast prices are rising. One of the purposes is to short change all those people who are on fixed incomes, including pensions, etc., which are all indexed to the CPI. So, as long as the CPI is low, pensioners of all sorts are getting tiny little increases to their payments, while their real costs of living are rising multiple times faster from all the excess money being created, as described above. 

5. One of the ways in which the CPI is manipulated lower is to use median rent as part of the basket of goods and services being monitored, instead of the cost of the dwelling and the land it stands on, because the latter is always higher than the median rent. 

6. One corollary here, of course, is that those who rent are being subsidised by their landlords. Anyone who has held and let out a residential property can attest that the rent is never enough to service all the maintenance and loan interest and rates and what have you, and that you have to subsidise that rent to meet all the expenses associated with that property. A property investor is willing to do this as a way of forced saving, and in the hope that the value of the property will keep pace with inflation, which it tends to do in the long term, but it can really go against you in the short to medium term, so the investment strategy is obviously not without risks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, PuntPal, I missed addressing  that question of yours before. The answer is this:<br />
1. CPI is always manipulated downwards, to disguise the real rate of extra money being created, borrowed, and lent out by bankstas, which eventually ends up one way or another as moneyflow into the real economy IN EXCESS OF GOODS AND SERVICES CREATED. </p>
<p>2. Any excess money and credit created like this, will end up pushing up nominal prices in some sector or other, simply because excess cash/liquidity is chasing the given and available goods and services at any one time. In other words, this is inflation. Money and credit hitting the economy in excess of goods and services created and available to purchase with that money within a the given period of time. </p>
<p>3. This is how you get rising prices, which nowadays is called inflation, instead of inflation being defined as it should be, as that which causes rising prices, and namely the said excess liquidity being pumped into the economy. </p>
<p>4. So, if inflation is defined as rising prices, then anyone claiming to fight inflation, will have to show that prices are not rising. This is one of the dirty jobs given to the ABS, so that the populace can be lied to about just how fast prices are rising. One of the purposes is to short change all those people who are on fixed incomes, including pensions, etc., which are all indexed to the CPI. So, as long as the CPI is low, pensioners of all sorts are getting tiny little increases to their payments, while their real costs of living are rising multiple times faster from all the excess money being created, as described above. </p>
<p>5. One of the ways in which the CPI is manipulated lower is to use median rent as part of the basket of goods and services being monitored, instead of the cost of the dwelling and the land it stands on, because the latter is always higher than the median rent. </p>
<p>6. One corollary here, of course, is that those who rent are being subsidised by their landlords. Anyone who has held and let out a residential property can attest that the rent is never enough to service all the maintenance and loan interest and rates and what have you, and that you have to subsidise that rent to meet all the expenses associated with that property. A property investor is willing to do this as a way of forced saving, and in the hope that the value of the property will keep pace with inflation, which it tends to do in the long term, but it can really go against you in the short to medium term, so the investment strategy is obviously not without risks.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
