- Money Morning Australia

Debunking War-nomics


Written on 14 January 2011 by Kris Sayce

Debunking War-nomics

Just a quick Money Morning today.  We’re getting stuck into the January issue of Australian Small-Cap Investigator.

And seeing as it’s Friday, we’ll wrap up an old topic.  Rather than start a new one.

Let’s be honest.  We can’t blame the mainstream economists for claiming the Queensland floods will stimulate the economy.

I mean, they’re just spouting on what university taught them.

And what were they taught?

For a start, they’ve been told the best example of economic stimulus was… the Second World War!

I’m sure you’ve heard the muppets on TV talk about the post-war boom and how fast the economy grew.

How the pre-war world economy was dire.  What with all that Depression stuff going on.

But then, like a bolt from the blue, the Second World War came along and stimulated the world to recovery.

And boy what a boom that was.  If only we can repeat it, we’ll be laughing all the way to economic nirvana.

Let’s compare a few numbers…

So far in the Queensland floods, an estimated fifteen people have died… now compare that to around 70 million who died in World War 2.

In Queensland it’s estimated 12,000 homes have been damaged by floods.  World War 2 wiped out millions of homes.  Not to mention the thousands or hundreds of thousands of work places.

Must try harder Queensland.  There’s just not enough stimulating going on.

We touched on this silly subject last September after the Christchurch earthquake:

“Why Creative Destruction is Good, and Destructive Destruction is Bad”

In it we wrote:

“The Second World War was no more of a positive economic stimulus to America or anyone else, than is the current Iraq War or Afghanistan War or the Vietnam War or the First World War or the American Civil War.”

It seems strange to make an economically positive event out of a natural disaster.  And to then compare it to the Second World War… a non-natural disaster event.

In all our searching of the Interweb, we’re yet to find anyone say the First World War or American Civil War stimulated the economy.

That can only mean one thing.  The Second World War fits nicely into the theory about government spending and economic growth.  Whereas the other two wars don’t.  They say the Second World War is an example of economic stimulus working… but they ignore the other two.

Mainstream economists have taken one data point and used it as the basis for their entire theories.  That’s a mistake according to Sherlock Holmes.

Over the summer holidays we’ve read the adventures of the pipe-smoking and cocaine-injecting sleuth.  In the short story, A Scandal in Bohemia, Holmes tells Watson:

“It is a capital mistake to theorize before you have all the evidence.  It biases the judgment.”

I’m sure your editor has been guilty to this “capital mistake”… but we’ll ignore that! [wink].  We’ll ignore it because we like the quote anyway.

I mean, if the Second World War caused an economic boom, what about the First World War?  Did that stimulate the economy?

Our friends over at Wikipedia tell us:

“The post-World War I recession was an economic recession that hit much of the world in the aftermath of World War I… After the war ended… the global economy began to decline.  In the United States 1918-1919 saw a modest economic retreat, but the next year saw a mild recovery.  A more severe recession hit the United States in 1920 and 1921 when the global economy fell very sharply.”

Hmmm… so much for war stimulating the economy.

These war-mongering economists ignore is that public sector war spending stops the private sector growing.

War sucks resources away from the private sector.  Resources that could be used to make cars and appliances and homes.  Instead the state uses the resources to make fighter planes, tanks and bombs.

War doesn’t stimulate an economy.  In fact, after the First World War it took longer for the economy to recover than it did after the Second World War.

In other words, wars don’t stimulate the economy at all.  Rather, they sedate it.  They delay economic growth.  Which isn’t surprising… I mean, there was a war going on!

Without the wars, the economy would have recovered sooner.  Without the First World War the economy would probably have recovered by the late 1910s.  And without the Second World War the economy would probably have recovered by the early 1940s.

Of course, we can’t prove that.  But we can confidently make the claim.

And in the same way, the floods in Queensland delay economic growth too.

Business that would have happened last week and today, isn’t possible.  The local grocer can’t sell groceries because his or her shop is under ten feet of water.

The local bicycle shop can’t sell any bikes because they’ve washed away.

And the local hairdresser can’t cut anyone’s hair because, well, having a nice “do” isn’t on many people’s mind right now.  Getting to the hairdresser might be a bit tricky too.

Anyway, we checked on the Interweb to see how the Christchurch earthquake has helped stimulate the New Zealand economy.  Turns out it hasn’t.  Funny that.

According to the National Business Review: “Another recession for NZ still a strong possibility – economist”.

Of course, that’s according to a mainstream economist.  So we should take what they’ve said with a grain of salt.  Even so, these are the same mainstream economists that thought the earthquake would boost the economy… yet it hasn’t happened…

And it won’t happen.

Remember: just because an economist says something it doesn’t mean it’s true.

To test this yourself, stop and think about it logically.  If thinking about the impact of a large-scale economic event is too daunting, scale it down a bit.

If mainstream economists are right about economic destruction providing a boost to the economy, just consider how economic destruction in your own home affects you.

Imagine smashing your TV with a hammer.  Sure, it’ll provide a boost to the TV store because you’ll need to buy a TV.  But it’s a drain on your bank account because you’re drawing down on savings.

Simple eh?

Well, it’s exactly the same for the broader economy.

The fact is economies don’t grow due to mindless destruction.  They grow through Creative Destruction.

That’s where new ideas and new technologies improve lives.  Where something new provides a better alternative to something old – like computers replacing typewriters… or cars replacing the horse and cart.

But the destroying a perfectly decent road and replacing it with a similar road isn’t good for the economy.  Just as destroying a home and replacing it with an almost identical home isn’t a boost either.

Both result in a waste of resources.  Resources that could otherwise be used elsewhere.

Get the picture?  I think you do.

Just remember that if something said by the know-it-alls in the mainstream media sounds rubbish, then odds are it is.

If we’re honest, the same could be said for your editor… if you think we’re not making sense just drop us a line to the Money Morning mailbag at moneymorning@moneymorning.com.au or post a comment at the Money Morning website.

Anyway, we’ve said just about all we can on this matter.  Time to get stuck in to the January issue of Australian Small-Cap Investigator.

Regards,

Kris Sayce
For Money Morning Australia



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Kris Sayce
Kris is never one to pull punches when discussing market developments and economic events that can affect your wealth. He’ll take anyone to task — banks, governments, big business — if he thinks they’re trying to pull a fast one with your money. Kris is also the investment director for Australian Small-Cap Investigator, Diggers and Drillers and Revolutionary Tech Investor. If you’d like to more about Kris’ financial world view and investing philosophy then join him on Google+. It's where he shares investment insight, commentary and ideas that he can't always fit into his regular Money Morning essays. Read more about Publisher and Investment Director Kris Sayce.

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93 Comments For This Post

  1. Tim Says:

    WWII shifted Germany and Japan into economic powerhouses.

    Not the destruction itself, rather the act of war.

    Rest of editorial is spot on.

    Apart from the 50k Lance is donating. What would he do with it otherwise? Roll around in it with podium girls and lines of coke (ok, I am just joking about the coke bit). I suppose the case could be made it sits in the bank which the banks can use as a deposit base to lend to small business. Oh wait. I meant the housing market, coz that’s more productive, isn’t it? Isn’t it? Chris Joye? No? Nobody?

  2. RD Says:

    I think the economic situation is slightly more complex than you make out. What you don’t factor in is government debt, ie from the private sector POV this event can essentially become a free ride if reconstruction is largely subsidised by the public sector taking on more debt (in one form or another). Think about it from say a tradies POV… a few months ago that were looking at a building down turn and would have been struggling to make ends meet. Now suddenly they are in high demand, will have a large income, and will be confident to start spending up big again, in turn helping retail yadda yadda. And the only downside… Australia will hold higher public debt than it otherwise would have (but who cares about that hey, just talk to America!).

    In a way this is really the same argument about whether government funded stimulus is a valid tool to pull economies out of recession, ie the balance of increased economic activity versus increased public debt.

  3. michael francis Says:

    If we blew up the banks and real estate industry, that would be pave the way to prosperity for all to enjoy.

  4. Janet Says:

    The same rubbish was spouted after the Christchurch earthquake. The ‘boom’ has not arrived; neither will it. It will take years and untold money that we as a country can ill afford, to overcome the destructive forces of nature. In fact in the latest Quotable Values property report, this week, Christchurch and surrounds were ‘left out’ due to the uncertainty surrounding the property sale statistics ( read that as :’It didn’t suit the report to show the value of any transactions, as they might distort the national median!)

  5. J.C. Says:

    Tim@1
    I think that Germany and Japan became post-war economic powerhouses because they shifted their productive efforts away from war and territorial expansion. They were able to focus their competitive advantages on building economies that weren’t focused entirely on war. I’m actually skeptical of Japan’s success because the U.S. had much to do in restructuring markets, etc. Nevertheless, I think Japan and Germany owe their success to productivity, self-sacrifice, and savings. In Japan’s case, the lack of any creative destruction has meant that their economy has struggled. Whether or not they could have been anything besides a manufacturer is unclear. However, they wasted their opportunity to become a sustainable creditor (even though they are among the world’s leading creditors).

    On another note, Aussie’s mining would be nothing without the Japanese involvement in the 70s and 80s.

  6. Neil Campbell Says:

    JC, you miss the point, the German & Japanese economic miracles were made true by the USA Marshall Plan – that is the massive cash injections to rebuild those nations and yes, they couldn’t rebuild militarily. Kris that was the difference between ww1 & ww2; the huge cash investments into the defeated nations to rebuild and to stop another Tojo or Hitler from taking advantage of the vulnerability & economic uncertainty. Mind you, the USA hastened the destruction of the UK, with it’s Lend lease program. The Commonwealth & State Governments will increase their ‘deficits’ to cover the Queensland flood crisis – not good news, but what else can be done?

  7. Jono Says:

    You could have made a much shorter post by quoting Henry Hazlitt.

    This is about the millionth time the old broken window fallacy has reappeared ever since he wrote Economics in One Lesson back in 1946.

    As Hazlitt put it, it is wrong to think that a broken window creates economic growth, by focusing only on the money paid to a window-repairer. As usual with economics, what is unseen is just as important as what is seen.

    – That money could have been used to employ somebody else.
    – That window repairer could have used his limited time to fix other windows.

  8. cb Says:

    MF @ 3 – Spot on. What is the difference between currency created by the bankers and lent into the economy at interest, and currency created by the government and lent into the economy interest free?

    Can anyone spot the scam? And the source of all this problem with debt?

  9. Kaye Says:

    I only joined Money Morning this week to get a perspective on real estate prices in Australia. Whilst finding some of Kris’s opinions agreeable, I am disgusted with the portrayal of the Qld floods. No compassion whatsoever shown for the thousands of victims, emergency workers and volunteers who are facing scenes not witnessed before in Australia on such a scale.
    I can appreciate that his offerings are investment opinions but money alone does not make one wealthy! As a Queenslander I find these articles offensive. Yes, I am very interested in what the floods will do to our economy. I am a lucky one who does not live in the flooded areas, but have friends of friends who have lost lives, houses and those whose own house was saved while they witnessed others washed away along with cars and dead bodies of their townsfolk.
    Kris, your articles would be a lot more appealing if I can see that you have a heart as well as a brain!

  10. dc Says:

    Australian Zionists
    http://opposingdigits.com/forums/about4292.html

  11. Nick Says:

    could this be the reason for the current events in the weather around the globe?….I still can’t see how a tax will stop it.

    http://21stcenturywire.com/2011/01/13/magnetic-pole-shift-may-close-airports/

  12. cb Says:

    dc – Turnbull is their chief man, whom they want to make their own PM, just as soon as they are able to manipulate things enough to make it all happen. But the other traitors are bad enough as they are, falling all over themselves and each other as Tel Aviv’s whores and bitches.

  13. dc Says:

    Nick – I could be wrong, but I suspect that this talk of a pole shift is part of the 2012 propaganda, which I believe this year is the end of the Mayan calendar which coincides with a “galactic alignment”, or so say the doomsayers. The bird and fish deaths are probably part of it too.

    I listened to an audio file on rense.com a while back, where this guy came one and gave a story about how in the year 2012, increasing solar activity will cause a massive solar flare that will supposedly flip the poles and causing major earthquakes. Complete charlatan material, but I’m sure they’ll milk it for all it’s worth.

  14. dc Says:

    cb – do you know where Gillard fits into the picture?

  15. cb Says:

    DC – I don’t have inside info. I simply judge them by their words and their actions. Based on that, the way she called Kevin, the trade union guy, “stupid” because he questions the official hogwash on 9/11 is one telling evidence about where she stands. Plus, she is all pro-Israel, just like all of them at and near the top are, without exception.

  16. cb Says:

    There is not a single straight one amongst them that I can see.

  17. dc Says:

    yes, it is no doubt political suicide to take any other stance

  18. Nick Says:

    dc….I agree with your scepticism and keep an open mind to all things. I stopped listening to MSM since about the time smart phones began their appearance and the internet was accessible. All my knowledge has come from people (personal friends, world wide) on the ground, so to speak in various fields and these are the ones I trust. I listen to all commentators eg. Celente, Keiser and numerous others, ONLY to “compare notes” with what I have been informed of. Much of what I know is only now beginning to surface. Only a couple of years ago if you mentioned NWO, you were a conspiracy nut. Now it is all over the media as a “solution” to the current crisis. What happened to the nuts??
    Nevertheless, how I view the pole shift/2012 thing is much like I viewed the Y2K bug fever. I was involved with this as I had to accompany electronic equipment I manufactured and sold with stat. decs. stating that my gear was Y2K compatible. I told many that this was a BS scam but it was mandatory to provide the paperwork as many clients were govt institutions and “big business”. So I did and bullshit it was.
    Now, 2012 could be exactly as you say, however, I keep an open mind in the sense that they could know something we don’t and are preparing to protect themselves (elite) via bunkers, seeds stored underground in Iceland etc. We are “expendable” should such a natural catastrophe occur. End of the world, definitely not, but chaos for a period, most probably.
    The ancients were very skilful in determining astrological events and timing. See here just one example of the ancient Greek’s Antikythera mechanism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antikythera_mechanism

    So with all our high tech of today, I’m certain they know more than they let on. The trick is to find out what and once we do, what can we do about it. When it comes to the boil, my personal opinion is that paper currency, super, and every other financial concoction will not be as relevant as we may like to think.

  19. Nick Says:

    as for Gillard…here’s some insight…

    http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/index.php/heraldsun/comments/why_hasnt_gillard_been_honest

  20. dc Says:

    Nick – I have heard reports about bunkers and seed safes, but these stories are usually on websites like David Ike’s.

    This makes me think that it is just more fear mongering, nothing like a distraction to keep us from learning about 9/11, while they quietly funnel our wealth out of the country, pass a new global currency or whatever nefarious agenda they are planning.

    Something to look for is some hard proof to back up the claims that these bunkers exist to the extent that they are reported and that birds and fish are really dying. I imagine, these reports can quite easily be faked, or wildly exagerated. Some skeptics are saying that massive die offs are not uncommon.

    But it doesn’t hurt to keep an open mind, if I find anything I’ll post it and I can only agree about super and fiat currency, they were never designed to work in the long haul, so what is the end game?

  21. dc Says:

    By the way, cb, I listened to that Mark Glenn interview which was excellent, but on a side note, I noticed that at the start of the show Glenn thinks that the Zionsists can bring the economy back to life, more or less at the flick of a switch if the need too.

    Glenn thought that if they get their way with their Iran war, that they would bring the economy back to life right away. Do you think this is a possibility, or do you think the US is in a terminal death spiral that it can’t escape?

  22. Fitch Says:

    Nothing will generate growth quite like the death of your creditor.

  23. cb Says:

    DC – For what it’s worth, this entire GFC has been engineered and artificially induced. What makes it stink so bad, is the same as with all the other scam crises that they are orchestrating, including muslim jihadis with explosives in their underpants and runaway global warming: the solution they are or will be proposing to it.

    Thus, to global warming catastrophy they propose a NWO bureaucracy that will regulate, police and tax energy production around the world, complete with carbon trading and carbon indulgences that they will sell for good money. To the threat of explosive islamic underwear they propose death ray machines, the suspension of civil rights and all manners of freedoms and liberties that should be our birthright. And, in a similar vein, as a solution to the GFC, they will propose a NWO financial system, dominated by these psychopathic crooks, complete with their own, supranational reserve currency, the SDR, which they want to replace the USD for all international trade, meaning that they want the world to work for THEIR shitty paper. They must be wetting themselves with anticipation.

    The GFC is the direct result of the various economies of the world being starved of their means of exchange. The so-called shortage of money is artificially induced and the tap can be turned on and turned off as they please. After all, fiat money can be created at no cost to those with a licence to print it, or otherwise declare it existent. Giving this power into the hands of private bankers is a scam perpetrated on the people.

    Currency and money flow are the life blood of an economy, in a closely analogous way in which our blood functions in our bodies. If you cut off the blood supply to one of your limbs, it will shrivel up and die. Same with the economy. Debt money, especially controlled by ruthless psychopaths means dependency, vulnerability, and ultimately slavery to those who control its supply and flow through the economy.

  24. Nick Says:

    dc…sorry it was Norway not Iceland, but here is some info. I also recall seeing a segment on 60 minutes some time back.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/norways-doomsday-vault-holds-seeds-of-survival-786773.html

  25. Nick Says:

    dc…I also am aware of a recent extension to the “bunker” under Australia’s Parliament House . This was announced by Rudd before Gillard knifed him.

    http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/politics/krudds-war-room-to-deal-with-all-manner-of-strangelove-situations-20091001-gdsj.html

    As for “total” control” being the agenda, I find that this will be resisted fiercely by many sides. If any such struggle eventuates, many sheeple will be awakened and there will be “finger pointing” resulting in intense friction and it will get ugly. Today, there is much in the arsenal to be used on us, not just things that go bang, but through countless ways of bio, physiological and environmental “warfare”.

    I am no expert on these matters, again I say, I merely know many who are and who have been accurate in every way in preparing me, in all my affairs, over my lifetime.

    By all means be sceptical and always question, I commend you on that and wish there were many, many, more like you. However, don’t let that scepticism take away hope. There is nothing new about conflict other than the sophistication of the “toys” being used. It just means that we should become more sophisticated in our “preparation” to counter the agenda.

    I have some 80 plus employees, all good people, I feel responsible for the continuity of their livelihoods, yet I don’t give up hope and constantly seek ways to protect that. Of course there are those clueless who label that as “greed”, but I soldier on and watch those individuals drown in their own bullshit.

    The danger is that the world’s young are becoming “idle” and as a result their frustration is at boiling point. I fear that this will be “harnessed” in very bad way by the manipulators.

  26. dc Says:

    Nick – yes it is certainly worth checking things out and trying to figure out what they are up to. It takes time and can sometimes mean, painstakingly digging through the internet for clues about even the most bizare of tin foil hat conspiracies.

    Because once you take the blue pill and begin to see the matrix you start to see how you have been consistently mislead by the official line, and if they concealed the truth about 9/11, you have to wonder what else they have hidden from us.

    One thing that has become apparent when I started to dig for the truth is that they use the media as a major propaganda machine.

    Recently I’ve begun to see that the main guys in the so called “truth movement” are planting as many false leads as they are good information. In fact I am stretched to name one guy in the movement who I’d regard as trustworthy.

    As for the report of the recent extension to the “bunker” under Australia’s Parliament House. It may well be true, but my feeling is that it is complete theater and just more fear mongering.

    It is also a hard one to check out unless you are an employe in the house of parliment.

    I’ve recently become skeptical about the population reduction agenda too. The bunkers and population reduction are exactly along the lines of the bogus War on Terror.

    When the masses are stirred up and terrified, it is much easier to pass more draconian legislation and to take more control, it is an old tactic that has worked beautifully up until now, except I think they have over done it and the world is catching onto the game.

    “I have some 80 plus employees, all good people, I feel responsible for the continuity of their livelihoods, yet I don’t give up hope and constantly seek ways to protect that. Of course there are those clueless who label that as “greed”, but I soldier on and watch those individuals drown in their own bullshit.”

    It is normal and natural to look out for your own interests. Likening it to greed is nothing but brainwashing. If the masses feel guilty about achieving a gain then all the better to fleece them!

    “The danger is that the world’s young are becoming “idle” and as a result their frustration is at boiling point. I fear that this will be “harnessed” in very bad way by the manipulators.”

    Who can blame them, they have been indoctrinated with BS from day one, have diminishing freedom, poor economic prospects and virtualy nowhere to go. Yes sadly the manipulators will try and exploit this, but this is the information age and there is a slow awakening, so I think those dinosours have had their day.

  27. dc Says:

    cb @ 20 – Soon after it started I thought it had an artifical appearance about it. But on the other hand could the US be about to crash Soviet Union style?

  28. Beauner Says:

    cb @ 20…..Farken AWESOME stuff bro!

    I’ll be quoting you on Facebook…. :D

  29. dc Says:

    apologies to anyone reading this who practices organised religion. just looking at this from the perspective of an elitist.

  30. oysterboy Says:

    This used to be a really good economics forum.

  31. Drew Says:

    Dc, you don’t do any favours for your credibility if you post links to articles about the holocaust being a hoax. Do some research (and don’t just Google topics that support your bias).

  32. Drew Says:

    dc @ 29 – Judaism doesn’t claim to be a race.

  33. cb Says:

    DC – The arguments are interesting, but without freedom of expression, enquiries about what exactly happened invariably degenerate into accusations of anti-semitism and racism, and even into outright prosecutions where principles of rationality and free speech are thrown to the wind as if they had no standing or value. It is what happens under fascist dictatorships where basic human rights are trampled on and the individual is totally defenseless against powers far greater than s/he can take on with any realistic chance of defending him/herself.

    But as to the question of race, the 13th tribe European Ashkenazi Jews, the descendants of the Khazar kingdom, are basically Caucasians, white Europeans like so many others, like Germans, the French, the English and the Slavs in Europe. The Middle Eastern Hassidic Jews are the only ones that can legitimately claim to be Semites, as they are related to the Palestinians. Beyond them, there appear to be Jews who are black Africans, and what have you (Are there Chinese Jews?). This is my understanding.

    So, no, there is no single race that you could identify as the Jewish race as such. At least not on the basis of accepted methods of taxonomy. You could try identifying them as a group, perhaps, as an ethnicity, like Germans, Gypsies and Romanians are identifiable ethnic groups, based on their background culture and language.

    However, even this sort of categorisation bcomes tenuous, since the Jews of the extinct Khazar kingdom (the Ashkenazi Jews who took up Judaism as a religion, so that they would not get subjugated by either the Christians or by the Muslims at a certain period in history), come from quite a different background from the Middle Eastern Hassidic Jews, so you could argue that these two groups come from quite distinct culture- and language-based ethnicities. The best you could claim here is that Jews are a relatively new, and mixed Ethnic group that have been formed from these two major ethnicities. But even this leaves the question of where you fit in the black African Jews as an ethnicity.

    That leaves religion as the only uncontroversial identifier for all Jews as a group. It is their religion, and the rules for determining their Jewishness by birth through the mother, is the only common characteristic that you will find all Jews, regardless of race or cultural bacground, share.

    See also this article about their languages, although I do not know how authoritative this particular site is on the question. As with most things, Jewish history is very controversial, because the Jewish version of their history is full of controversial and many would argue contrived myths in order to justify political purposes and claims. Those who challenge these myths can quickly find themselves in the cross-hairs of Jewish hatred and persecution. That, sadly, is the ugly truth.

    http://www.brighthub.com/education/languages/articles/45025.aspx

  34. cb Says:

    Drew – If that be the case, then on what basis do they accuse their critics of anti-semitism? The charge of anti-semitism is a charge of racism, since the Semites are a race. But the majority of Jews today are Ashkenazi Jews, white Europeans, not Semites, so they should not claim to be a race, because they are clearly not a separate, identifiable race of humankind, as such. But then that also should mean that they cannot accuse people of being racist when they criticise Jews or their religion.

  35. Drew Says:

    cb – the term anti-semitism might not be technically correct – but that happens a lot in the English language. The term has come to mean “discriminating against or being hostile toward or prejudiced against Jews” and does not imply that Jews think they are a race. I agree, however, that the term racism is cleary wrong, but I don’t hear that term incorrectly used very much.

  36. cb Says:

    Drew – The thought police here have used it plenty of time.

  37. cb Says:

    dc – To be sure, religion has been used as a political tool by rulers to keep their subjects pacified and compliant. The notion that it has been invented by the ruling class is probably inaccurate. Man is naturally fearful of the unknown and superstitious by inclination. The human mind will invent all kinds of stories and explanations in its attempt to understand the world around it, and its place in it, and even on a more abstract level its very existence. Many of these notions and explanations are erroneous, but once adopted, are not easily dislodged from one’s world view and belief system. Organised religion makes this process especially hard, where authority figures with conflicted interests dictate to the plebs what is right and what is wrong, what is correct and what is not, and what is real and what is not. My take on religion is that it is a more or less coherent and systematic belief system that properly falls under the categories of myth, make belief and superstition.

  38. cb Says:

    Further to the con being referred to above @ 6, the ugly truth about the world’s troubles with money, debt and corruption:

    Thursday, January 13, 2011
    Mike Rivero : Pay No Attention To That Fraudclosure Behind the Curtain
    http://geraldcelentechannel.blogspot.com/2011/01/mike-rivero-pay-no-attention-to-that.html

  39. dc Says:

    Nick – Speaking about bunkers, I have seen reports about many other celebrities who have said they are building bunkers.

    They seem to use different stories catering to different propaganda lines, such as the line used by Tom Cruise, a Scientologist, who claims his bunker is to protect against alien attack.

    I know it sounds completely ridiculous and I’m sure it is, but a celebrity like Tom Cruise has major influence over a certain segment of the population who I’m sure would believe every word he says.

    Heck if people believe guys like David Ike who tell us that our world is run by shape shifting lizard aliens, what is to say that a certain segment of the population do not think that a deposed galactic ruler ‘Xenu’ is plotting an evil revenge attack on Earth.

    http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/showbiz/article-23414203-tom-cruise-building-5m-bunker-to-protect-against-alien-attack.do

    If there is a major imminent event coming soon such as a pole shift, or asteroid strike, etc, that they know about and we don’t, then I’d question why these reports are coming out in such a coordinated fashion.

    If such an event was immiment why would they even tell us at all?

    I see a pattern and smell a rat.

  40. cb Says:

    On Economic Fascism, and the looting of the plebs.
    This is a direct link to Part 3, but parts 1 and 2 are also very good.

    Economic Fascism Explained & Continued Part 3 – Mike Rivero
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MN72dbd8Ynk&NR=1

  41. cb Says:

    DC – The privileged and the criminal are simply trying to find safety in a looted and dispossessed world that is becoming more aware and angry by the day. Talk of pole shifts and other natural disasters are noise and distraction to throw the sleuths off the scent. It is a case of the conjurer and hypnotist telling you “look at me, look at me,” while they accomplish their tricks. That’s my basic take on it, anyhow.

  42. dc Says:

    cb @ 20 – from what Michael Rivero is saying on his shows, the banks are actually in deep trouble, which is why they are trying to loot as much wealth from the people, by foreclosing on properties to prevent them from going bankrupt. This would indicate that the financial collapse that we see is genuine and not engineered as many people believe.

  43. dc Says:

    The Ugly Truth Podcast Jan 14, 2011
    http://theuglytruth.podbean.com/2011/01/14/the-ugly-truth-podcast-jan-14-2011

    Nashid Abdul Khaaliq and his Roland Zuercher join the program for a round table discussion of the latest news including the arrest of 70 Christians in Iran and the church bombings in Alexandria.

  44. cb Says:

    DC – We need to distinguish between the man who holds the gun to your head, and the gun itself. A gun is a tool, an instrument for doing serious physical damage with relative ease, and a bank is a tool, a financial instrument for making money, AND to do serious economic damage to society with relative ease.

    The people behind these tools can do anything they choose with their instruments, including throwing them away and sending them bankrupt. Having made the economy dependent on the private banks, by corrupt politicians giving the licence to print money to them, they are now able to threaten the economy by threatening to blow themselves up. Hence the expression: suicide bankers. So, yes, the GFC has been engineered and is purposeful. The bastard suicide bankers are threatening to take the world down by crashing the money machine. This would be hillarious, if it wasn’t so outrageous and sad. The money machine rightfully belongs to the people, not to private bankers to start with. Do you follow what I am saying?

  45. cb Says:

    DC – Right on the topic, here is the explanation of how the bastard bankers are starving the economy of its lifeblood:

    Ellen Brown.Author, Web of Debt
    Posted: January 13, 2011 10:40
    The Fed Has Spoken: No Bailout for Main Street
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/ellen-brown/the-fed-has-spoken-no-bai_b_808094.html

  46. cb Says:

    Having just read Ellen Brown’s article, she has it all sussed and explains it all very nicely. The only credible answer to the question why the obvious solution is not being adopted by the politicians is this: that they are in the pockets of the private bankers who are creating and maintaining this crisis for their own, selfish and psychopathic purposes. But they are propbably pushing their luck too far. Pushing America’s middle class out of their homes and onto the streets is likely to backfire at some point.

    But instead of coming to their senses, they are building private bunkers in which to survive the gathering social storm, which is just another manifestation of the criminal stupidity of which they suffer.

  47. dc Says:

    cb – so are you saying that the reckless derivative trading and other practices that put the banking system in such a perilous position was completely engineered to serve a purpose?

    It is clear that these financial institutions are the ones pulling the strings and have the power over the government, but could this simply be stupidity and greed by the institutions that caused this scenario and now they are forcing the government to bail them out to save their necks?

  48. cb Says:

    Yes, DC, although it is both complex and simple.

    - Simply put, the game is: Heads, they win. Tails, they get bailed out at everybody else’s expense. With such a setup, why would they not gamble with reckless abandon?!!!

    – Beyond that, as you get into the minutae of the instruments, the nuts and bolts they invent and use, it is a jungle. Plus, there is the bigger agenda of NWO global plans for world financial and economic domination, and the gambling house setup described above plays very nicely into the hands of the elite at the top of the gambling and skinning establishment. For, the more the corrupt governments and the people can be pushed to the edge of desperation, the more pliable they become to accepting and even welcoming the conmen’s solutions.

    That is the big picture, and the little scams and derivatives instruments fit in here and there, and goodness knows exactly where in the giant jigsaw puzzle. However, if you adopt this big picture view of your working hypothesis, you will find that so many otherwise unexplainably and apparently stupid and dumb things fall into place and make perfect sense.

  49. Nick Says:

    “However, if you adopt this big picture view of your working hypothesis, you will find that so many otherwise unexplainably and apparently stupid and dumb things fall into place and make perfect sense.”…..
    Precisely!…and there you have the relationship with “what has it all has to do with finance”.
    Know the “trend” and you know the “game”…..and consequently, what to do with your share portfolio, superannuation, savings, business and generally your financial affairs. After all, it’s your pound of flesh they want, how do you intend on protecting it?

  50. dc Says:

    cb – I skimmed the start of that article and notice that according to the constitution, none of the money produced by the Fed is allowed to be passed onto the individual states. Given that the federal reserve act was drafted by Jewish bankers themselves and given the sordid history of Jewish money lenders like Rothschilds, then you’d have to conclude that yes, that is probably no accident.

    Do you think the banks that are on the edge of going belly up, the “suicide bankers” are witting or unwitting participants in terms of the bigger picture NWO agenda?

  51. dc Says:

    The Piper Report Jan 14, 2011
    http://theuglytruth.wordpress.com/2011/01/15/the-piper-report-jan-14-2011

    “A New Perspective”–MCP addresses the possibility that Zionist interests used the latest hubbub over the alleged “Jewishness” of Congresswoman Gifford’s shooter as a fact finding mission, as well as an indepth discussion concerning Martin Luther King Jr and the manner by which Zionist groups such as the ADL spied on him.

  52. dc Says:

    Earth must prepare for close encounter with aliens, say scientists
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2011/jan/10/earth-close-encounter-aliens-extraterrestrials

    World governments should prepare a co-ordinated action plan in case Earth is contacted by aliens, according to scientists.

    They argue that a branch of the UN must be given responsibility for “supra-Earth affairs” and formulate a plan for how to deal with extraterrestrials, should they appear.

  53. dc Says:

    South Sudan votes
    http://seeker401.wordpress.com/2011/01/15/south-sudan-votes

    “ive put together a lot of information here because its very important..you are seeing the creation of a new country..out of an old country..by coincidecne the new country is also right in the middle of the oil fields and is christian majority..the poorer north is muslim..getting the picture..which side is the usa on?..and this is a blow to china..they are greedy for energy resources and this has just taken out a key player they could have used..enjoy the read..”

  54. cb Says:

    Yes, Nick. As you responded to that question a while back, it has EVERYTHING to do with it!!!

    On a related point, have I missed your response to my earlier question about what our banks are likely to do if, and when, the USD should go PUFF? You asked it as a rhetorical question a while back earlier, and I would like to know your thoughts on the likely effects and moves this is going to initiate over here. Thanks.

  55. cb Says:

    DC – Think of those banks are their primary weapons and factories of mass financial destruction. It is through these banks that they manufacture all those financial nuclear time bombs that go by such exotic sounding names as CDOs, CDSs, etc., etc.

  56. cb Says:

    lol, dc @ 53 – the freakin bastards are really getting desperate to take people’s attention off things. It looks like scientists have become the last lot of so-called experts that they are mobilising to give credence to their schemes, scams, and hogwash stories.

  57. cb Says:

    According to Bob Chapman, this year is not something to look forward to:

    “January 12 2011: Economy still stagnant despite money injections, US and Europe wont be able to repay most of their debts, free trade, globalization and the phony terrorism all linked together, little or no gold left in the US treasury, Wall Street cuts Treasury holdings, Fed balance sheet wont balance for some time to come.

    In the US the problems of municipalities will finally start to be addressed as federal funding and loans are ended. ….
    In the final quarter of this year both the European and American problems will be exposed full force. This will bring about a worldwide financial crisis as the true depths of the problems are fully revealed. The impact on western finance will be more devastating than the Bear Stearns and Lehman Bros. collapses. At this juncture the timing is difficult, but that time frame seems reasonable.”

    http://www.theinternationalforecaster.com/International_Forecaster_Weekly/Today_The_Destruction_of_Money

  58. cb Says:

    Beauner – You have bee wondering out aloud about what the world might look like in ten years time. May I suggest that you read Chapman’t free article linked above. Here is another quote from it:

    “As we have predicted in the past we see a meeting of all countries, as opposed to unilateral action by Europe or the US. A meeting along the lines of the Smithsonian talks in the 1970s, the Plaza Accord of 1985 and the Louvre Accord of 1987, where all nations will revalue and devalue and default multilaterally 50% to 66%. Everything will be on the table. By doing it this way it becomes a simple business transaction and not a situation where everyone is ostracized. This will be detrimental to currencies, bonds and shares. Commodities and gold and silver and the shares will appreciate as they did in the 1930s and the late 1970s. It’s a hard road to take, but it is the only one open to the elites.

    One of Ayn Rand’s disciples, one Alan Greenspan, spent his entire time as Chairman of the Federal Reserve destroying money. Ms. Rand warned of destroyers appearing among men who would destroy money. As she said, “This kills all objective standards and delivers men into the arbitrary power of an arbitrary setter of values. Paper is a check, drawn by legal looters upon which an account which is not theirs.”

    Today we have the destruction of money – the mediums of exchange – free trade, globalization and the phony terrorism all linked together. A 3-pronged attack to create confusion and fear and as an extension to control and destroy the wealth of the masses. This is a marriage of monetary, fiscal, geopolitical, economic and financial terrorism. The terrorists are in the banks, on Wall Street, in the City of London and running transnational conglomerates that are destroying our society and that of Europe. This complex paradigm is relentlessly day by day creating chaos within society. Needless to say, we have war and occupation thrown in for good measure in Iraq and Afghanistan. This is a profitable distraction and at the same time a method of culling the population of useless eaters. As this all transpires, immune from prosecution, Wall Street and banking pull one outrageous fraud after another. As an example, as we predicted, the Attorney Generals have rolled for the bankers in Foreclosuregate. Five major banks are being allowed to settle with some 50 states. This decision was made in secret by your elected states’ Attorney Generals. This is one of the biggest frauds in American history and all that will happen is the major banks involved will get a slap on the hand and a chump change fine. The public will get nothing. Any fraud by the too big to fail banks is now permissible.

    The fraud is now so pervasive and systemic that foreigners, particularly at the upper levels of the corporate world simply refuse to do business with American companies. American executives, particularly from Wall Street and banking, contend there are simply no rules or only their rules. This will elevate into trade war eventually, which has been coming for a long time and actually a trump card for US elitists. The ugliness is still under the surface, but it exists and is gaining momentum. Once that becomes reality the financial system will break down. As we have said many times once that happens all these criminals will become fugitives from justice. If other countries try to hide these people they will be sanctioned and isolated, and that shouldn’t take long. We should have courts to try these crooks. They should go to jail and their entire families be stripped of their wealth, which would go to the US Treasury. Those who committed treason should have all their assets confiscated and they should be hung.”

    That will be the day to see.

  59. cb Says:

    dc – See especially second para on what we have just discussed, quoted from Chapman, as referenced above:

    “In silver there is still a giant naked short position and over 30 class action lawsuits, one of which is RICO. In addition, the silver market is deeply short of silver for delivery. That means $30.00 should be easy. There is massive pressure to the upside, as there is in gold. In addition, almost every time we look both gold and silver are in backwardation. That is when the spot month trades higher than the active outside month, which is bullish. There is no doubt that now is an exceptional time to buy both gold and silver. The public in the US and Europe are not really in the market as yet. At some point they will arrive triggered perhaps by $2,000 or $3,000 gold, or perhaps $60 or $70 silver. We don’t know what the trigger will be, but it is coming. When they arrive it will be like thunder and lightening to the upside and there will be no stopping it.

    Pensions and Investment Magazine says Newt Gingrich is pushing for legislation to allow bankrupt states to file bankruptcy, and in that process renege on pension and other benefit obligations to state workers. It also means that those holding municipal bonds would be wiped out. This is a neocon dream backed by the same trash that accompanied the last moron we had for President, whose name will not pass our lips. This is nothing more nor less then a frontal attack against the average American to put them in an economic and financial position from which they have no leverage and will be forced to accept world government. It just goes to show you that you get no assistance from either party, because the same elitists groups control both. The chance for elimination of incumbents is passed and we fear what the future reactions will be.”

  60. cb Says:

    Naked intimidation in the land of the (once were) free. Only a couple of steps away now from 1984.

    Witch Hunt FBI Targets Conservative Bloggers
    http://www.thirdage.com/news/witch-hunt-fbi-targets-conservative-bloggers_1-14-2011

  61. dc Says:

    cb @ 61 – yes it has the appearance of a carefully crafted wealth funnel. Like our housing bubble.

  62. dc Says:

    cb @ 62 – I’m sure the guy is just a nut, but what better excuse for the thought police? They didn’t even need to do a false flag.

  63. dc Says:

    Global food shortages could bring riots to the US and rest of the world
    http://seeker401.wordpress.com/2011/01/16/global-food-shortages-could-bring-riots-to-the-us-and-rest-of-the-world

  64. dc Says:

    Republicans to put a halt to EPA backdoor CapnTrade
    http://seeker401.wordpress.com/2011/01/16/republicans-to-put-a-halt-to-epa-backdoor-capntrade

    Republicans in the US Congress have wasted no time in using their new majority in the House of Representatives to try to block the authority of the Environmental Protection Agency to act on climate change.

    In their first full day in the new Congress, Republicans outlined three different bills – encapsulating three different strategies – aimed at limiting the agency’s powers.

    The first would declare that greenhouse gas emissions are not subject to the Clean Air Act. The second would block funding to any government agency associated with cap-and-trade. The third is seeking a two-year delay in EPA regulation of carbon dioxide and methane emissions.

    The Republicans also shut down a House committee that had tackled energy and climate issues.

  65. Nick Says:

    Cb…on the matter of “what happens to Oz banks should the US default”.

    Let me stress, i’m no economist. I’m simply a businessman, ship’s captain if you like, seeking to chart the waters and weather ahead so as to maintain the safety and smooth sailing of the crew.
    I rely on those who know the waters a little better and, as often a captain does, relies on the local pilot to assist him in negotiating the waters.

    First is the question, do we believe that the US will default. All countries I deal with do believe so and have lost trust in the US. E.g India seeking to trade goods with Iran in gold (not US$). The big boys are doing this and seeking to trade outside the US$. I can guarantee you the smaller players, such as my clients, have been working on this for some time, as I have mentioned some time back. So I’m not so optimistic that all is OK with the US$.

    However, let’s assume that the US does default. My interpretation of the consequences, as explained to me, is that banks will be forced to increase interest rates to keep money in Australia.

    The flow on of this is that the real estate market will be delivered a kick in the guts which at the moment it doesn’t need. Businesses which are heavily leveraged will suffer a hit as well. Again, at the moment, I am told buy a business broker, “you can be assured that about 90% of business you see are looking to sell, but won’t get their price as they are mostly operating on fumes”

    There is a starting point from which I leave the better informed to comment. Do we believe, that our banks can cope with such a “downturn” US style.

    Kris exposed the issue of the “secret loans” the Oz banks took from the Fed. What would have happened if they didn’t?

    Another point of concern, for me and other business people I know, is that as most of the worlds currency is in digits, what happens in the case of a cyber attack? Science fiction? Israel has done it to Iran with some very invasive software and the recent cyber attacks on VISA/Paypal etc as revenge for Assage’s arrest. So that can’t be “out of the question”.

    Most of my employees are paid in cash so I need to ensure this doesn’t get disrupted should e.g. a “bank closure” occurs. Far fetched? Perhaps, but even a ship’s captain ensures that there are sufficient lifeboats on the ship to ensure that ALL his crew have an escape plan in the remote occurrence of the ship sinking.

    From what I am being informed, there is a greater chance of our economy sinking than any cruise ship currently afloat.

  66. cb Says:

    DC @ 66 – Watch the bastards move towards what will be called a UFO tax. It looks like they are starting to sound out the possibility of creating a UFO hysteria, a whipped up threat made to order, and then every nation will have to contribute to a UN program to prepare the world for possible, and possibly hostile, alien contact.

  67. cb Says:

    Thanks, Nick. I would certainly agree with that. In the event of accounts being frozen, everything would come to a standstill. With no means of payment, trade stops, and there are simply not enough people and businesses out there with enough coins and bullion to switch over to the metals as a means of exchange and payment. If everybody had half of their savings in the metals, for example, a switch over would not be easy, but it would be manageable. But like this? No chance. Besides, people would only part with their gold and silver for the absolutely basic necessities. That would be my guess, anyhow.

    About the US defaulting on its debt, well, that is inevitable in the sense that the US government will never repay the monies it has borrowed with the same purchasing power as when it borrowed it. As a general rule, provided they can print the currency in which the borrowed, governments never do, so there will be nothing new in that.

    Along these lines, many contend that the US will not formally default, but will instead continue to print up the money to meet its obligations. Whether this will in turn lead to a disorderly run from, and an outright rejection of the USD, is a little unclear.

    What are your thoughts on this scenario? Will there be a wholesale dumping of the USD at some point? Is this the scenario you had in mind, or were you thinking that the US might in fact tell its creditors to take a haircut and accept 10 or 5 cents on the dollar as repayment?

  68. Nick Says:

    cb….I believe that in the first instance, the US will print 24/7 for as long as they can. This is known by the major countries and their supporters. They are securing their “long term plan” with the clear assumption that this will not end well.

    The currency game will get vicious which the plebs will suffer for. Once this “game” runs out of puff, and the plebs think that they are winning the game, the culprits will pull some other “stunt” to make the plebs accept the whatever is offered as a solution, which is as you have already mentioned.

    We may be resource rich, but so is Sth America, India, Africa and others. In ALL countries except Australia, most of the population live in what we would call poverty. How long do you think this scenario can continue?

  69. neil walker Says:

    In reference to debunking war economics I feel whilst the wars gain little for the economy [ or actually take from it rather, as you suggest, dollar wise] it unfortunately can in some cases be the wake up call needed for us to stop and think about the manner in which we treat our fellow man ,realising that each and every one of us in general has an equal right to co-exist in this world. We after all did not choose to be here in the first place. Imagine how much better all our economies could be without wars. Yes it costs nothing to dream.! does it !

  70. cb Says:

    Thanks, Nick. Yes, deadly games with no end in sight. So, do you still think that the safest place for one’s savings while getting through all this turbulence is in the metals? For us, I mean, here, Downunder?

  71. cb Says:

    Interesting goss. There is increasing speculation that the real target of the Tucson shooter, the Jewish nut who murdered half of dozen people, was Judge John Roll, who through his repeated judgements showed his commitment to uphold the constitution and was becoming more and more of an obstacle to the criminals robbing the poeple of the US of their retirement savings.

  72. cb Says:

    And the hypothesis, obviously, is that the shooter was a controlled and heavily drugged nutter, who in spite of having been threatening people for months, was being protected by local law enforcement.

  73. cb Says:

    Bob Chapman discusses it in the early part of this interview.

    Bob Chapman : there is more to the Arizona shooting than what we are told…
    http://bobchapman.blogspot.com/2011/01/bob-chapman-on-global-opposition-to-new.html

  74. cb Says:

    Chris breaks down muni collapse
    http://maxkeiser.com/2011/01/16/chris-breaks-down-muni-collapse/

  75. dc Says:

    cb @ 74 – Interesting..

    Mike Piper thinks that the shooter is not actually Jewish, even though a rumour that he is Jewish went viral on the internet. Piper is the only one I’ve seen say this which makes me wonder if he’s spinning.

    If the guy was heavily drugged and crazy, it would be a pretty risky strategy for an assassination.

  76. dc Says:

    cb @ 73 –

    are we at risk of hyper inflation here, as seems inevitable in the US if they just go on printing money? In our country we don’t have a mechanism to print currency like in the US, but could hyper inflation still happen?

  77. cb Says:

    Well, it looks like larger silver bars are becoming rather scarce. This company, for instance, is not even quoting for 1kg and 100Oz bars, which they used to do daily.
    http://www.kjc.com.au/bullion/bullion.pdf

  78. cb Says:

    DC @ 79 – That is an excellent video clip by Brother Nathanael.

    Unfortunately, I have no ide how a very high or even hyperinflationary scenario for the USD is going to play out for us. That is why asked Nick specifically about this question. This would be rather important to understand for all of us down here. If the USD becomes like a hot potato, presumably the AUD is going to strengthen very rapidly against it. The big unknowns are our interest rates, property prices and the overall economy. Anybody has thoughts on these?

  79. dc Says:

    cb @ 84 – if we go with the analogy that the bankers can turn the economy on and off like a tap, they might engineer a recovery, change course at the last second and avoid hyper inflation too, if they have such control.

  80. JB Says:

    Nick @ 16
    Most inciteful.
    She’s always made my skin crawl – just hearing her voice gives me the creeps

  81. JB Says:

    cb @ 20
    Precisely!
    Makes you realise just how clueless the masses are…
    if only they knew what you and i know to be true – this would result in a change of government all over the word – and people would again be in control of their own destinies.
    no longer will money creation be in the hands of these private banker scum, but returned to the control of each and every nation.
    no more money creation at interest to these scum, but created interest free by governments.

    it’s so simple, yet will the message ever get through??
    the elitist sh!t4brains mainstream media will continue to do their utmost to prevent this knowledge from filtering through to the masses…

    your thoughts?

  82. JB Says:

    Oysterboy @ 30:
    It still is!
    In fact it’s way better now, because we’re actually getting an understanding of what’s happening “under the hood”…

    Happenings in the world economy are often not the result of the laws of economics, but instead the results of manipulation by powerful groups, most notably the elitist private bankers.

    If you cant understand that, then perhaps its best to stick to the mainstream newsgroups, where you can feed on all the BS being served there.

  83. cb Says:

    DC – Yes, they do have all that control, except for some complicating factors. The main problem with all the QE they are doing at the moment is not that they are printing money, as such. Rather, the main problem is that they are not putting it into the real economy, into Main Street, but rather into the privileged banks who speculate and invest in offshore markets, instead of the domestic US economy. Most of what they spare for the US as such, goes to the Federal government, which spends like a drunken sailor, and of course pays all that interest on borrowings with it. The currency printed is showered on privileged banks at next to no cost at all, and on the federal government, while the businesses, the private sector back in the US, as well as the local, municipal and state governments are being starved of currency, of the means of exchange. Do you follow me to this point?

    Now, they could reverse this with the flick of a switch. As soon as government and the Fed started to put people to work to rebuild the US’s infrastructure, money would start washing through the economy, because people would be earning wages and could go and would go shopping with it, etc., etc.

    The danger they are running is that by the time they decide to start doing that, to put America back to work, the international markets decide to dump the USD, in which case American import prices would go to the moon, meaning hyperinflation and a total rejection of the currency, starting overseas, but then quickly spreading domestically, at home in the US, as well.

    At that point, they would have to come up with a new currency, which would wipe the savings in cash, in bank accounts and dollar denominated assets for anyone holding them. The tangible things, like houses, land, and the metals would still have value, of course, but the purchasing power of anything paper, or that which is owed to people in paper, would be toast.

    And, as Bob Chapman says, they would need to back the new currency with gold, but they will probably not going to opt for anything of the sort, because they will want to keep replaying this whole game again and again. What they might do, however, is to give gold backing to the USD in international trade, though not domestically, if it looks like the world is going to reject the USD.

    But two things need to be considered about this possibility:
    1. They might and might not have the gold with which to do it.
    2. Even if they do have the gold, they might not WANT to do it. After all, George Soros has by now gone on the record saying that the USD should be replaced with the SDR as the global reserve currency and the means of international trade.

    If the latter is the main game of the globalists, as it indeed appears to be a critical element in their vision for a new financial world order, then our working has to have this as a background assumption in the formation of our expectations. In short, even if they could save the USD from hyperinflating, they will probably not do it. Unless, of course, the American people take back their country from these globalist locusts and gain control of their own money and currency.

  84. cb Says:

    Sorry, where it makes no sense, I meant to say: “working hypothesis”

  85. cb Says:

    Sigh, JB, i fear tht you are right. The message is unlikely to get through while the locusts maintain control of the MSM. It is complex enough as it is, and with MSM parroting propaganda and misinformation at already brainwashed and sleeping populace, very few will understand the depth of the scam, or even the mechanisms through which it is pulled on us all, as a nation.

  86. dc Says:

    cb @ 89 – I’d imagine they would have tons of gold as the result of their systematic looting of countries including the US over the years and Australia as was indicated by that article I posted recently.

    Yes I suspect the SDR might be part of the agenda, in which case they might just let the dollar continue to decline. Do you have any idea how the introduction of the SDR would work and what impacts it would have to people’s savings, both in the US and here?

  87. hey HORSHACK Says:

    Special Drawing Rights (SDRs)

    http://www.google.com.au/search?q=SDR&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

    December 9, 2010

    The SDR is an international reserve asset, created by the IMF in 1969 to supplement its member countries’ official reserves. Its value is based on a basket of four key international currencies, and SDRs can be exchanged for freely usable currencies. With a general SDR allocation that took effect on August 28 and a special allocation on September 9, 2009, the amount of SDRs increased from SDR 21.4 billion to SDR 204 billion (equivalent to about $308 billion, converted using the rate of August 31, 2010).

    The role of the SDR

    The SDR was created by the IMF in 1969 to support the Bretton Woods fixed exchange rate system. A country participating in this system needed official reserves—government or central bank holdings of gold and widely accepted foreign currencies—that could be used to purchase the domestic currency in foreign exchange markets, as required to maintain its exchange rate. But the international supply of two key reserve assets—gold and the U.S. dollar—proved inadequate for supporting the expansion of world trade and financial development that was taking place. Therefore, the international community decided to create a new international reserve asset under the auspices of the IMF

  88. cb Says:

    dc – I have no idea. However, they are all floating relative to each other already, although the more cynical will tell you that they are all sinking at various speeds relative to real money.

    http://www.imf.org/external/np/fin/data/rms_five.aspx#cvsdr

  89. cb Says:

    But since the SDR is just another, supranational fiat currency, and given that it is debt money in the sense that it does not comes into existence until someone borrows it into existence, at interest, of course, countries who need to borrow would have to start borrowing in SDR from the IMF in order to facilitate its circulation. What holds back the loan-hungry hordes, I know not.

  90. cb Says:

    Although I can imagine that, if China does not accept SDRs as payment for its plastic junk exports, then a loan-hungry country who wants to buy the plastic junk from China is not going to borrow in SDRs. But the whole idea of offshore borrowing is a scam to start with. What is the difference between the money printed up and lent to the Irish by the Fed, and the money printed up by the Irish government itself?

    The answer is that the one from the Fed comes with a huge price tag attached to it in the form of fees and interest, whereas the other one would be essentially free. So, why don’t the Irish then print their own currency and put the nation back to work? That, indeed, is a very good question, but the brainwashing and the corruption run so deep that the Irish themselves do not stop to ask the question. Same goes for all overseas borrowings.

  91. cb Says:

    dc – Oh, yes, the elite have plenty of gold, allright. But that is all in private hands, and they will certainly not put it up to back the USD. My question was whether the US Treasury has the gold to back the dollar, and that is what is in doubt.

  92. hey HORSHACK Says:

    Fort Knox wouldve been pillaged ages ago …..bout middle ’71 IMO

    the whole system,reeks,stinx & makes me sick………………

  93. dc Says:

    The Irish might not print their own money because they are afraid to go against the world elite. The world elite hate sovereign nations and would probably make life difficult for a government that dared to put the needs of their people before their exulted masters.

    Didn’t you say all the gold in Fort Knox mysteriously disappeared? All the gold is probably right now sitting in the vaults of that “clearing house” the BIS, if I were to take a guess.



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